Since people in the Group found this helpful in dealing with the Unforgivable Sin, I thought I'd post it here.
1. Blasphemy, by its very definition, must be spoken out
loud. "Blasphemous thoughts" are thoughts that would be blasphemy if uttered. No matter how nasty a thought may be, thoughts cannot be blasphemy unless they are uttered. Even if the thoughts somehow could be blasphemy,...
2. Jesus says in the very statement in which He speaks of the Unpardonable Sin that ALL blasphemies will be forgiven, whatever their content- but that THE blasphemy against the Holy Spirit will not be. It is obvious from this that since THE blasphemy against the Holy Spirit is not included in "ALL blasphemies," it must be something very different from merely saying something nasty about God (again, thinking something nasty about God, if it is not uttered out loud, cannot be blasphemy in the first place). It is unique.
3. Since Jesus says categorically that He will never, under any circumstances (the Greek says mh ouk, an intensifier that means "No way, Jose!") cast out anyone who comes to Him, it is obvious that nothing that does not prevent a person from wanting to come to Jesus can be the unforgivable sin.
4. It follows from that that a person who wants to be forgiven cannot have committed the unpardonable sin. If you recall, Hebrews makes that very point: a person who has committed the unforgivable sin cannot be restored to repentance.
5. In any event, "pop up" thoughts are not sins of any kind, which means that regardless of their content, they do not need forgiveness. And it is in the nature of OCD that if we fear that "pop up" thoughts come from us, it will "feel" to us like they do. That does not change the fact that if we hate the thought, it either a) is an OCD thought, in which case it is not even a sin; or b) since we hate and fear the thought, we have repented, cannot have committed the unpardonable sin, and are forgiven.
I'm afraid you just can't get around it. Even if a thought you hate or that you wish you hadn't had is sinful, no matter what the origin, all you have to do is to accept Jesus's forgiveness and you have nothing to be afraid of. You have repented. Then, whatever else may happen, you may be certain, first, that you have not committed the unpardonable sin; and secondly, that you are forgiven.
If its OCD, it's not a sin; if it's a sin, it's forgiven- and if you hate the thought, that is proof that you have not committed the unpardonable sin.
Any way you look at it, if you're worried about having committed the Unforgivable Sin, you have no reason to be.
The writer David Justice delightfully explores this enigmatic concept in his book Murphy on the Mount. A private investigator just happens to read about this concept of the "Unpardonable Sin" and the "Blasphemy Against the Holy Spirit". He deals with growing angst over the issue as he also has to solve a mystery. Here's my discussion of the book:
ReplyDeleteBlasphemy Against the Holy Spirit - The Unpardonable Sin
But what if whilst resisting such thoughts you inadvertently say one out loud?
ReplyDeleteNo. If it's accidental it means nothing. I have done it countless of times accidentally. Accidentally talk sin and intentional sin are two very different things. It's like if you accidentally hit somebody, you don't need to repent for that.
DeleteRead the rest of the post.
ReplyDeleteIf you want forgiveness, you have not committed the Unpardonable Sin.
You should also be aware that for an individual with OCD, "resisting the thought" is the worst possible strategy. God designed the mind to include thoughts, not to exclude them. To try not to think a thought is to guarantee that you will think it. The famous illustration is what happens when you try not to think of white elephants for thirty seconds. It is impossible!
I am a sufferer of OCD, and someone who holds christ on the cross dearly and deeply in my heart. Thank you, for this piece, for it has brought peace to my heart that may last a lifetime.
ReplyDeleteGod Bless you deeply.
Me too i almost say it but it stopped i think God stopped me from my thoughts to say it but it not said beecause it is in my thoughts Thank You Lord and for the message God Bless You.
DeleteTrying not to think the thought is what keeps it coming back. Ignore it. It means nothing. It thrives on attention.That's the way the human mind works
DeleteI just came across this site a week ago, which was my first introduction to "scrupulosity". I just thought I was going crazy. Thanks for the resources! I am now reading Ian Osborne's book "Can Christianity cure OCD?" Great book.
ReplyDeleteAmy, you made my decade.
ReplyDeleteDave, I quite agree. Dr. Osborn's other book is also great. For those who don't know, he's a Christian psychiatrist who actually has OCD.
That is beautiful, I kinda have the same thing, and sometimes avoid going to church cause of it.
ReplyDeleteDon't. The Law is for the proud; the Gospel is for the sorrowful. Remember that, and whatever you may hear of the Law will be a help in your effort to live a life pleasing to God, but it will no longer be a threat.
DeleteAs a sufferer of this unpardonable sin obsession, I have now turned to John 6:37 and obsess about that. I know He won't cast out those who want to come to Him, but I fear this sin somehow prevents me from TRULY coming...like those with spurious faith who reach the end of life and hear we didn't REALLY hope in Him. Scary.
ReplyDeleteThat's a common kind of OCD reaction. Of course, it doesn't mean anything. How can one "kind of" come? You either come or you don't. If you want His forgiveness, you have it. Its as simple as that. Don't let your OCD complicate it.
DeleteYou don't REALLY hope or believe or SORT OF hope or believe. You do, or you don't. You're also not saved by coming to HIm. You're saved by HIm. Get your eyes off of yourself and on Him, where they belong. It's not about you. It's about Him.
I am afraid.. I have had horrible blasphemous thoughts about HS and Jesus that i NEVER want to think. I am also worried if i have said something so horrible that God does not want or can't forgive me. Is there a way to know for sure that you have not committed this sin? I want to belong to Jesus, but I am afraid that he will not accept me
ReplyDeleteYes. If the thought that you have committed this sin bothers you, you haven't committed it. If you want to belong to Jesus, you do. The Unpardonable Sin springs from a condition of the heart such that it rejects Him so so stubbornly and so finally that the Holy Spirit ceases to strive with that person, and the very fact that you're bothered by the thought of having committed the unforgivable sin and want to belong to Jesus means that He is still in your heart and still working there.
DeleteSo it is not just some blasphemous words that people say about HS?. I fear if i have said something about Him and being guilty of an eternal sin.
ReplyDeleteYou are saying that the person who truly commits this sin has no worry and he does not want to belong to Jesus?
Is the HS same thing as conscience?
Right. Remember he begins by saying that ALL blasphemies can be forgiven. But "THE blasphemy against the Holy Spirit" is a great deal more than words that may be said. It's the final and irrevocable rejection of Jesus, to whom the Spirit testifies.
DeleteNo, everyone has a conscience. The conscience is merely what be believe to be right and wrong. The Holy Spirit is God, the Third Person of the Holy Trinity, Who comes to us in the Word and changes hearts that want to be their own gods and want nothing to do with the real one into hearts that believe Christ's promises and trust Him. It's only by the power of the Holy Spirit that any of us can believe; apart from Him we're "dead in trespasses and sins."
Thank you for your reply.
DeleteSo in summary:
the sacrifice of Jesus is perfect and covers any sin you can imagine if you only repent and turn to Jesus?
It is the work of the HS to lead us to Jesus and if someone commits unpardonable sin the HS leaves this person alone and this person has no remorse or worry and he cannot be restored to repentance?
Well, Jesus did say that he won't cast anyone out but are there any exception?
I have worried that Jesus rejects me even thought i want to come back.
Right. There are no exceptions;
DeleteOne suggestion: see a doctor about selective seratonin reuptake inhibitors. Sounds like you may have a touch of OCD.
Another suggestion: Join the Scrupe Group. The link is at the top of the page.
Thanks. You are right i am diagnosed with OCD and i have a medication for it. It all started with non stop blasphemous thoughts.
DeleteIf you accidentally say out loud these blasphemous thoughts to other people can you still be forgiven? When i was talking to my brother i think that i had a slip of a tongue. Does God understand that i don't want to say anything bad about him?
ReplyDeleteI want to repent but i am afraid that my sins are too great to be forgiven...
Didn't Jesus said that the Pharisees were guilty of an eternal sin and they would never be forgiven?
You already have repented. And yes, you can. God is not trying to damn you on a technicality. He went to the cross to save you from hell.
ReplyDeleteJesus knew the condition of the Pharisees' hearts, but actually no. He didn't say that the Pharisees had actually committed the Unpardonable Sin, though they were certainly in danger of it.
Thoughts can't hurt you. But trying not to think them will always cause them to come.
ReplyDeleteI have suffered from these horrible blasphemous thoughts about HS since last september. I was in my support group and i had to talk to a total stranger. When we were chatting i had slipped one of my blasphemous thoughts out loud. I want to belong to Jesus but i fear that Jesus rejects me because that one slip of a tongue.
ReplyDeleteI read a blog where a man said that God and Jesus spoke to him and they said that if you commit the unpardonable sin there is no forgiveness for that. I am so scared. Does God understand the pain and suffering i have?
You might want to read the post again, and also the other comments on this post.
DeleteFirst, I seriously doubt that God (and Jesus IS God) talked to that person. Secondly, yes, the unpardonable sin is unpardonable; that's why it's called that! :) But the unpardonable sin is not something you say. It's regarding the Spirit's witness to Jesus as evil and persisting in that attitude until you are beyond the point where repentance is possible.
If you are worried that you committed the unpardonable sin, you haven't. You have repented if you're sorry for whatever you said or did, and if you had committed the unpardonable sin you would not be.
Could you please explain why worry is a sure sign that you have not committed it?
ReplyDeleteDidn't the original greek word mean speaking against?
That man claims to have several apparitions from God the father and Jesus and he said that if anyone speaks against the HS there is no forgiveness. I'm so scared. I have Blasphemous thoughts running around in my head and i am afraid that what if i have said some of my thoughts out loud.
I don't want these thoughts but i can't get rid of them. I am diagnosed with OCD and i have a medication but they don't really help all that much.
If you are upset about something you've done, you've repented. And if you recall, Hebrews 6 explains why the unpardonable sin is unpardonable: the person who has committed it cannot be restored to repentance. Remember, it's the Holy Spirit who works repentance in us!
ReplyDeleteAs I pointed out above, Jesus explicitly says that ALL blasphemies will be forgiven. Not all OTHER blasphemies. ALL blasphemies. But THE blasphemy against the Holy Spirit will not be. Clearly the unpardonable sin is not ordinary blasphemy, as in saying something derogatory about God. It's blocking the Holy Spirit's ability to work in our hearts by regarding His work as evil, and doing so to the point where the heart becomes completely calloused against His influence. The unpardonable sin is not unpardonable because God is unwilling to forgive it, but because the person who has committed it is unwilling to be forgiven.
Jesus says quite clearly that He will never turn away ANYONE who comes to Him. Clearly, then, if you can come to Him, you have not committed this sin. Conversely, if you have committed it, you will not be willing to come to Him.
Stop TRYING to get rid of them! Close your eyes and for the next sixty seconds think of anything you want- except purple bears. Ready? Ok. Go!
How did you do? You couldn't think of anything but purple bears, could you? That's because God created our minds to retain information, not to exclude it. The very act of trying not to think a thought ensures that you WILL think it.
So stop trying. If the thoughts come, let them come. Let them be there. Don't react to them in any way. They are harmless. They are not even sins, since they're the result of bad wiring in your brain, and don't come from your heart. The more attention you pay to them- the harder you try not to think of them, and the more significance you give them- the more you will think them. The less attention you pay to them, the less they will come.
Ok.Thanks Robert
DeleteHow about my case? My fear is of my actual blasphemies. The ones born out of bitterness, fear and anger (and ultimately, unbelief). My life is consumed with worry, and fear, in good part born of chronic fatigue and sleep problems. I get mad and curse God; I say things I won't repeat here. I do this willfully and with my eyes wide open. I even swear that I'm done with Christianity and determine to never return, but I always come back. And I feel welcomed back. But it starts all over again.
ReplyDeleteIf you come back you've repented, and Hebrews 6 says that a person who has committed the unpardonable sin can't repent.
DeleteIt's the Holy Spirit Who brings about repentance- and who causes you to care. So if you care, you believe. And if you believe, you cannot have committed the unpardonable sin.
By definition, nobody who is afraid of having committed the unpardonable sin can possibly have done so.
Thanks! I need to remember that Jesus said, "him that cometh to me I will in no wise cast out!"
DeleteI had today horrible thoughts about HS. Does God understand that i don't want these thoughts?
ReplyDeleteI want to repent but i don't know what does it really mean.
What is the biblical meaning of repentance?
Was Jesus's sacrifice really perfect? Is there any sin that Jesus's blood does not cover even if you beg for mercy and want to repent and belong to him?
When i try to pray and ask forgiveness it feels that Jesus does not want to hear me because of my blasphemous thoughts that i don't want.
Did Jesus ever reject anyone who came for him for forgiveness of sins?
I fear that i have messed up my life so badly that Jesus does not want to forgive me anymore :(
Take a deep breath and read the article.
DeleteYes, God knows that you don't want the thoughts. In fact, He knows that none of us can control the thoughts that come into our minds. In fact, He knows that the reason that you have them so often is that you try not to have them.
You have nothing to repent for, since you haven't committed a sin. And that being the case I'm not going to enable your obsession by even discussing repentance.
Jesus's sacrifice was perfect and there is no sin which is not forgiven to all believers whether they beg and plead or not. But again, what you are talking about is not a sin.
What you feel does not reflect reality. What you feel has nothing to do with reality. What you feel is simply a feeling. Christ's sacrifice and promises are objective facts which remain true no matter how you feel about them.
Jesus says point blank, to translate the Greek literally, that He will "never-no, never" reject anyone who comes to Him.
Your fear is a symptom of mental illness. The truth is that Jesus underwent death by torture in order to forgive you and there is nobody in the world that He does not want to forgive even more than they want to be forgiven.
What you have to do now is trust Him and bet the farm on His promise rather than continue to enable your obsession by asking for reassurance, which prevents you from trusting Him.
Thanks Robert. What did Jesus mean when he said that "No one can come to me unless the Father who sent me draws them"
DeleteFallen human beings by nature want to be their own little tin gods. They want what they want, and they want no part of God telling them what they should want or do or be like. We lost the ability to choose God in the Fall.
DeleteBut God changes our hearts. He enables us to believe. In fact, He works faith in our hearts through the Word and the Sacraments. When the Father sends the Holy Spirit through these, our hearts change and our wills are freed.
Another way to look at this is that in our natural state we have only our fallen natures. But in baptism we receive a new nature- one that loves God, trusts Jesus, and wants to please God. The life of a Christian is a constant civil war between the Old Self and the New Self. The Old Self remains with us until our dying day. but by God's grace we daily claim our baptism again, drowning the Old Self so that the New Self can take his place, burying the Old Self so that the New Self can arise. We call that process "repentance."
To say that we are saved by grace alone is simply to say that God changes us, we don't change ourselves. We don't make a decision for Christ; in another place He says, "You have not chosen Me, but I have chosen you." God creates faith in our hearts through the Word. Every impulse toward Him is His doing, His gift.
That's a great comfort, because it means that our salvation isn't in our own weak, fallible human hands. It's in God's hands. We can mess up. We can drop the ball. But He can't, and won't. Faith is simply leaving our lives and our eternal destinies in the hands of Jesus where they are safe, instead of trying to dot all the "i's" and cross all the "t's" and do it ourselves. We will always mess things up, in ourselves. But God can and will keep us safe.
And the whole thing begins when we believe- not because of a choice which may or may not be sincere, and may or may not be adequate in a hundred other ways, but because it is God Who works within us "to will and to do His good pleasure."
So my very desire to be with Jesus means that the Father is drawing me to him. Thanks Robert.
DeleteExactly.
DeleteIs the Epistle to the Colossians reliable even if we do not know for sure who wrote it?
ReplyDeleteI have found these passages comforting. When you were dead in your sins and in the uncircumcision of your flesh, God made you alive with Christ. He forgave us all our sins, having canceled the charge of our legal indebtedness, which stood against us and condemned us; he has taken it away, nailing it to the cross.
The Scripture says that the writer was Paul but Scholars have questioned Paul's authorship
"Scholars" question just about everything, whether there's anything to question or not. The blatant and obvious silliness of "The Jesus Seminar" is an extreme example, but never allow your faith in a text to be shaken merely by the fact that certain scholars question its authorship.
DeleteHistorical Grammatical scholars tend to accept Paul's authorship; historical critical scholars tend not to. Remember that the difference is that historical criticism by definition rules out the supernatural whereas historical grammatical criticism is open to the possibility of it. For Historical Grammatical scholars, the Bible is the Word of God; for Historical Critical scholars, it's basically just another human book which may possibly contain the Word of God to some extent. Maybe.
Both embrace literary criticism. It's not that Historical Grammatical scholars don't also take seriously the tools by which dates and authorship are established; they just don't assume that the fact that a book mentions an event prophetically means that it must have been written after the event took place. So more is involved here than what the evidence indicates. The more thoroughly one buys into the historical critical method the more abandon one is apt to display in reaching conclusions which have less to do with the evidence than with precisely one's presuppositions regarding the nature of the text.
Historical grammatical scholars see the text of Scripture as inspired by the Holy Spirit; Historical Critical scholars see it simply as just another human document. So it shouldn't be surprising that the former treat the text with more reverence than the latter and are less rash about deciding that long-accepted beliefs about authorship are wrong. Both ask the same questions, but Historical Critical scholars are far more willing to reach more radical conclusions on the basis of less evidence.
The thing to bear in mind is that the Church closed the canon in the Third Century. No council or synod made the decision; it was a consensus spontaneously reached by the entire Church as to which books contained apostolic content and which did not. The conclusion was firm enough that it wasn't until the Council of Trent and the Counter Reformation that the Roman Catholic church bothered to actually define the contents of the canon! So if you accept the notion that the Holy Spirit was involved in the process of the Church's definition of the canon of the New Testament, you're on solid ground in trusting the authority of Colossians whether or not Paul was the actual author. And again, conservative scholars still believe that he was.
So the short answer is that you can trust the canon. It's been believed "always, everywhere and by all" that Colossians is apostolic in content. Highly questionable conclusions by scholars not necessarily committed to the authority of Scripture in any case shouldn't shake your trust in what the Church has always embraced, with the Spirit's guidance and by common consent, as the inspired Word of God.
What did Paul mean when he wrote that Now if I do what I do not want to do, it is no longer I who do it, but it is sin living in me that does it.
ReplyDeleteI have suffered from unwanted blasphemous thoughts. Does that verse mean that because i never ever want to think them, it is not me but the sinful nature that lives inside me?
No, because the unwanted blasphemous thoughts are not sins. They are the consequence of a neurological disorder and in fact come precisely because you try not to think them.
DeletePaul was talking about real sins- things which spring not from a medical condition but from the evil in our hearts. Every Christian is a walking civil war between the Old Self and the New. Paul is talking about his Old Self, which continued to plague him (as it does all of us) despite the desire of his New Self to please God with what he does. Unfortunately the Old Self has other ideas. It wants to please itself.
Thanks for answer. What if you accidentally say that thought out loud even if you don't want to. Would that be sin?
DeleteWhat do you think?
DeleteI don't know. But anyone who wants to come to Jesus can still be forgiven, right?
DeleteYes you do. You're seeking reassurance, which is a good way to stay enslaved to your OCD. Do you really think God is out to get you if make a mistake?
DeleteYes, anyone who needs forgiving gets forgiven if he comes to Jesus. Or better, if he believes that for Jesus's sake he is forgiven.
Could you please explain this verse? for God's gifts and his call are irrevocable.
DeleteDoes this mean that God never takes away person's salvation.
It absolutely means that. We can reject Him, but He will never take back His promises.
DeleteIt really scares me when I read that the Lord only calls us to himself twice and if we don't respond, it's too late. We can beg and plead, but it is to late . This doesn't seem to line up with the fact that His call is irrevocable or Lamentations 3:31 The Lord will not reject forever. Is it right that I look back to what Christ did 2000 years ago because I have really messed up and at times felt myself just turning to the darkness? Does a good shepherd really turn away a sheep that has been called but didn't immediately come?
DeleteThen don't read such demonic drivel. THAT is blasphemy, and whoever told you that will have to answer for it.
DeleteJesus says very clearly that He will never cast away ANYONE who comes to Him. And we can't come to Him unless His Spirit is drawing us. No matter how many times we have turned our backs on Him, He will NEVER refuse is if we turn back to Him. Our doing that is not our doing at all. It's Gods doing in us!
Perhaps I should add that God will not force anybody into heaven if he or she is bound and determined not to go there.
ReplyDeleteI am a sufferer of OCD and obsess about having committed the unpardonable sin. I read that this sin is attributing the HS to being evil, and now my brain won't stop repeating that phrase over and over again. I hate the thoughts and wish they'd go away. I know the HS is good and holy but my mind keeps pushing untrue and evil thoughts into my head. I feel hopeless and doomed for hell. Does God know that these thoughts are from my OCD and not me? I'm scared and am living in constant fear that I'm condemned
ReplyDeleteRead the article and also the other articles on this subject on the blog. Also the other questions and answers above yours. You cannot have committed this sin if the thought that you might commit it bothers you. It is NOT a thought, and the very act of trying not to think a thought will always MAKE you think it. Let the thought be there and ignore it.
ReplyDeleteThe unpardonable sin is hardening one's heart against the Holy Spirit's work to the point that He no longer seeks to work repentance in you. Hebrews specifically says that it is a characteristic of this sin that the person who has committed it cannot repent, Given that you are in agony over the thought that you might have committed it, I don't think that's the problem, do you?
Read my answers to the question above yours. They're the same for you.
Hi my names Jamirah and I'm 13 years old. Every since I've searched up what blasphemy against the holy spirit meant. I got all types of thoughts like "I hate God" "I reject Jesus" You blasphemed against the holy spirit Jamirah now your definitely going to hell" "You called the holy spirit demonic" PLEASE HELP ME. Even though I read that I will be. It feels that I won't be
ReplyDeleteWhat you feel is irrelevant. It means nothing. You get the thoughts because they are the last thing you want to think and you are trying not to think them. That MAKES you think them. Try for the next minute to think of anything in the world but onions and see what happens.
ReplyDeleteCouldn't think of anything but onions, could you?
Read the post above. Read the other posts on the subject of the Unpardonable Sin on this blog. Read the comments. You are no different from all the other people who have this irrational fear. Nobody who is afraid that he or she has committed the unpardonable sin can possibly have committed it.
Hi Robert. Have you ever suffered from these disqusting blasphemous thoughts? I just worry because i have had these worst imaginable thoughts and it sickens me. It all started when i first found out the unpardonable sin verses. I only hope that Jesus understands that i would never ever want to think these thoughts.
ReplyDeleteYes. Be comforted by the knowledge that it's well-established in psychology that: 1) everyone has random thoughts, which mean nothing; 2) that they can have almost any content; 3) that if one is afraid of them and tries to censor them, they are apt to assume the very form of which that person is most afraid; 4) that the harder one tries not to think of them, the more frequently they will come, and with more intensity; and 5) that the problem of fearing and trying to control one's thoughts is pretty much the definition of an "obsession," as the term is used in discussing OCD.
DeleteJesus is God, and God made the human mind. Believe me, He knows it inside and out. He also knows something which should help people with OCD who have this problem: that the very fact that the thoughts disturb the person who has them proves beyond any doubt that they are thoughts the person does not want and do not reflect the content of that person's heart.
Hi Robert. Could you please explain what Matthew 12:37 means?
ReplyDelete"For by your words you will be acquitted, and by your words you will be condemned."
This verse has been giving me anxiety because i thought that this verse says that people can do or say something sinful and Jesus says that they have crossed the line and there is no forgiveness for those people even if they want to come back and repent.
Words and works show the same purpose: they provide evidence of the presence (or absence) of faith in the heart.
ReplyDeleteYour interpretation would seem to be more than a bit of a stretch, given the number of times Jesus says that He will never turn away anyone who comes to Him, that all believers will share heaven with Him, and that nobody can even come to Him unless drawn by the Spirit. Good example of just how irrational the thoughts OCD foists upon us can be.
Rob, you wrote, "if its OCD, it's not a sin; if it's a sin, it's forgiven- and if you hate the thought, that is proof that you have not committed the unpardonable sin."
DeleteI keep struggling with this "backdoor spike" where I'm not experiencing anxiety, even when I force the words to come to mind. I feel like I could say these words all day long against God. Why is that? My mind feels so numb, that I'm not sure if I even hate the words or not. Have you experienced this? Any ideas? Does faith come back eventually after leaving the thoughts alone and allowing them to be there?
I'm not a therapist and I don't even play one on TV, but could it be because you're used to feeling guilty? And why do you assume that faith is gone? Do you think that it's a feeling? Really?
DeleteGood question! I don't believe it's about a feeling and I see your logic in that question, and it helps me by reminding me of it's not about feelings but rather faith in Christ. I guess I worry alot about the harding of heart because I feel like I get bitter towards God because of my OCD. It's difficult to not feel abandoned right now.
DeleteYes, you're a sinner. Welcome to the club!
ReplyDeleteHi Robert. I have a problem that is quite uncommon but that is troubling me so much.
ReplyDeleteI found this testimony of a young girl who claims that she went to hell for 23 hours and met Jesus.
There is one section that causes my anxiety. That testimony claims that people who watch animated cartoons and japanese anime are sent to hell.
Watching cartoons, playing video games and collecting figures are my hobbies but this testimony is really troubling me.
Could you please read this testimony? Tell me what do you think of it.
https://christiscoming777.com/2015/08/27/angelica-zambrano-1st-testimony-of-heaven-and-hell/
I find it hard to believe that it's anything but the result of an overactive imagination and some very bad theology. She clearly denies the Faith by maintaining that we have to earn our forgiveness by forgiving others rather than our forgiving others being the natural result of understanding that we are forgiven ourselves. She has people being damned for sins that Scripture doesn't say are sins. She doesn't understand the basics of the Gospel and is completely blinded by the Law.
DeleteI could go on, but suffice it to say that I don't take her "vision" seriously, and I would advise you against it, too. God isn't fond of false prophets, and saying things in God's Name which he hasn't said is serious business.
Oh. One more thing: I would think that God would know His own Name! "Jehovah" is a guess at the vowels in God's name as given in the Old Testament based on plugging in the vowels from "Adonai," or "Lord." The Jews excluded the vowels because they wanted to be absolutely sure that they couldn't misuse The Name even by accident (one of the ways they refer to God is "Ha Shem," meaning "The Name."
They were wrong. Scholars are fairly certain that the Name is "Yahweh," meaning "I am Who I am." I kind of think that He would know that.
Angelica, in any case, seems not to.
Hi Robert. I'm scared that I committed this sin. I get a lot of blasphemous thoughts, and recently I got frustrated and I said something even though I was meaning something else and then I realized what I said. It's hard to explain. And now I'm scared that Jesus and the Holy Spirit left me. I know I would never blaspheme. And before this happened I was really trying to avoid these thoughts and when I get frustrated it's like I'm not in full control. This gets me really sad because I have been trying to have a better relationship with Jesus. And now this happened.
ReplyDeleteIf you had committed it you wouldn't be scared about having committed it. If the Spirit had left you, you wouldn't care. And trying to avoid such thoughts is the worst possible strategy because to try not to think a thought is by definition to think it! Of course you're not "in full control." None of us are.
DeleteThe way to have a better relationship with Jesus is to remember that He will never leave you or forsake you, that He promises never to reject anyone who comes to Him, to focus on the completeness of His atonement rather than on the quality of your own obedience and repentence (which boils down to trying to be saved, or at least be assured of salvation, by your own works; that's unbelief) and by always bearing in mind that it's not about you. It's about Jesus.
Hi Roberts,
ReplyDeleteMine is a bit different. I believe it started by OCD. I also believed my mind could utter curse words against the HS. I tried to fight it off but I knew I may not succeed.
So I began to worry that I had probably said curse words to the HS in my head. There was no way to check to be sure but to try to see if I could really say it in my mind. So I will try to rehearse it half way in my head. At length I said it in my mind complete against HS.
I was wrong. I have asked God to forgive me.
Then He has. Only thorough the Holy Spirit could enable you to see that it was wrong!
DeleteAre intrusive and blasphemous pop up thoughts sins or just a form of temptation?
ReplyDeleteI have suffered from these disqusting thoughts against HS and i hate these thoughts from the bottom of my heart. Does Jesus understand that i don't want these thoughts?
I love Jesus and God and all i want is to be forgiven but i fear rejection.
I have heard so many different teachings about what this sin is and usually people say that if you are worried about it then you have not done it.
But there have been those who teach that this unforgivable sin is an exception in God's grace and there is no forgiveness for it even if sinner wants to come back and repents.
Neither! They are the result of the random nature of thought and the fact that the act of trying not to think a thought cause you to think it. It is neither a sin nor a temptation. It is simply background noise.
DeleteI don't know how much more clearly Jesus could say that there ARE no exceptions to God's grace. Not even one. And remember: a sinner COULDN'T want to come back and repent unless the Holy Spirit worked that desire in him. In our selves, we are by nature enemies of God. Only by God's grace does the Spirit operate through the Gospel to cause us to want peace with Him and to believe. While we can always reject that work of the Holy Spirit and insist on remaining God's enemy, if we want God's grace that in itself is God's doing in us.
hi I'm scared that I'm an apostate and that I've blasphemed the holy spirit when I was in 5th grade I had a battle with ocd I remember praying to God everynight so he can help me and eventually my ocd faded after it faded I stopped praying in my teenage years I went through an agnostic/atheist phase and questioning and I asked my self what if Jesus was possesd or what if he's the devil I'm scared he won't forgive me now I'm 15 year old
ReplyDeleteWhat does Hebrews say? You cannot have committed the Unpardonable Sin if you have repented. God has already forgiven you. Jesus promises never to cast out anyone who comes to Him. Cling to that promise, go to church, receive the Supper, and bear in mind that Christ's body was broken and His blood shed FOR YOU, and in token of that He's actually giving it to you- entering you and becoming part of you!
DeleteI am having these thoughts that i blaspheme the holy spirit i said i dont want anything to do with beelzebub . Next thing is like i mean jesus ,now i am not sure if i said i mean jesus or if it was a thought that said to me i mean jesus meaning i calling jesus beelzebub i am so hurting by this i want
ReplyDeleteto live for jesus
Try for the next minute not to think of warthogs. Think of anything else you want. Just not warthogs.
DeleteHow did you do? Well, I already know. You constantly thought of warthogs, didn't you? That's because God created the human mind to retain information, not to exclude it. If you are afraid of a thought or are trying not to think it, that very fact will make you think it constantly.
Nobody can control is own thoughts, and as I just pointed out, the more afraid you are of a thought the more you will have it. The answer is to recognize that God knows how the mind He created works. The thoughts are not sins, and God knows that they don't come from your heart. The answer is to ignore them and not respond to them in any way. There is no reason to be afraid of them or address them or to pay any attention to them. Just let them be there, knowing that they have no siginficance at all.
The more you are able to do that, the weaker and the less frequent the thoughts will be. But the more afraid of them you are and the harder you try to push them away, the stronger they will be and the more often they will come.
Hi, I had a blasphemous thought about a Preacher . Look, I never doubted the Work of God in his life, but on the day the blasphemous thought came, I rejected it several times and rebuked it. But I am still scared and worried. The blasphemous thought was like attributing the Power of God to the Devil. Even though I never doubted the anointing of God upon that Preacher, I am still pretty scared. COULD I HAVE COMMITTED BLASPHEMY? I've cried several times and gone on my knees begging God for Forgiveness, But I am still worried.
ReplyDeleteYou can't blaspheme against a preacher! Nor is God's anointing of a preacher ever an issue. The issue is whether that preacher is proclaiming His Word in its truth and purity. He will always bless His Word no matter who speaks it, and if it is not his Word, it shouldn't be spoken from the pulpit no matter who the preacher is who speaks it.
DeleteAnd a thought cannot be blasphemy. Blasphemy must be spoken out loud. In any case, even blasphemous words cannot be instances of the Unpardonable Sin if the Holy Spirit has worked regret and a desire for renewed communion with God in your heart. Hebrews says explicitly that a person who has committed the Unpardonable Sin cannot be restored to repentance. You have contrition. All you lack is trust that Jesus told the truth when He said that He would never cast out anyone who comes to Him.
Trying to do erp. I'm feeling a little lost because I did give into my OCD...I'm so numb inside and that scares me..I don't want to be given over. I want God but my OCD is fighting me. trying to do ERP therapy.
ReplyDeleteI have this line of thinking I can't seem to get past with erp. It's about the unpardonable sin. I have this worry.. if there is a way to messeup, I can. I recently read that it's a hard heart that gets you in trouble with God. With my OCD theme I'm having..I worry that I can keep committing blasphemy in my mind and harden my heart. Not sure how to correct this way of thinking.
Someone please give me some advice...I'm heartbroken.
You aren't committing blasphemy. The blaphemous thoughts are the worst possible thing you can imagine- which is why your OCD is using them against you.
DeleteTo try not to think a thought is by definition to think it! Thoughts are harmless. If they came from your heart you wouldn't be upset by them. And you are about as far from being in danger of hardening you're heart that it's almost funny! Your heart is so soft that it's bleeding all over the place!
Correct your way of thinking by ignoring those meaningless thoughts and remembering that the very fact that they bother you is proof that the Holy Spirit is in your heart. Unbelievers don't worry about being unbelievers! Only by deliberately and consistently rejecting God over time does a heart become hard, and again... you are about as far from that as it's possible for a person to be!
So if you had thoughts in your head it does not count as uttering?
DeleteUttering means speaking out loud, not having thoughts in your head. And again, the unpardonable sin isn't certain words you say. It's a rejection of the Holy Spirit so final that He no longer strives you convict you of your sin. And if you're worried about having committed it, apparently He hasn't given up on you!
DeleteHello, I too suffer from tormenting thoughts (for decades now) as the other commenters have mentioned. I have thought all sorts of horrible blasphemous thoughts about God/Jesus/HS and terrified of committing the unforgivable sin. I beg for forgiveness and protection. Sometimes my OCD goes dormant and then it flares up again horribly. Lately it has started back up again and I get thoughts in which I fear that I want to commit the unforgivable sin, that what if one day I will commit it and do so willingly. I get horrible thoughts that what if I want to be evil and against God and perhaps that this means I am doomed to be an evil person especially if I get thoughts fearing that I want to be evil. I am very afraid that I will become evil willingly and be against God or more evil if I already am for having thought this. Is there any hope for me?
ReplyDeleteI have horrible blasphemous thoughts against the spirit jesus and god and I'm terrified of hell and being without jesus
ReplyDeleteI hav OCD. The bad thoughts abt the holyspirit is coming in my head and hearing the bad voice for 24/7 and for 2 and half months. Every second i am fighting. But sometimes, i read the bad sentence against the holy spirit. Sometimes i am fighting. I dont know I done it intentially or the devil brings the bad words in front of my eyes. I am very sad and i am not happy. Because i loved holyspirit a lot.but now i dont know how i am doing it against him. I hate me. I thought to live my life for god. But now, completely i hate my life. I don't know he will forgive me or not. I didnt talk bad about holyspirit in my mouth. But when i talk gud abt him, at the sametime the bad sentence is appearing in front of my eyes. And at the same time , i am reading it sometimes in my mind. I dont know how it was happening. I am not worried about going to the hell. But I am worried tht I hurt god and holyspirit a lot of times. I ruined his expectations. I hate my life because of it.
ReplyDeleteSo if you had thoughts in your head it does not count as uttering?
ReplyDeleteUttering means speaking out loud. And even if you spoke them out loud they would not be the unforgivable sin if you didn't persist in having them in your heart. As it is, they weren't really from your heart to begin with.
DeleteI've struggled with obsessive thoughts for a long time now. Even since I was a child, before I knew about the gospel, my mind was invaded by blasphemous thoughts that scared me. These thoughts have returned with some force as a result of the confinement and inactivity of the last few months. Today and the last few days have been particularly difficult, but reading your post as well as the responses to the comments made a difference for me, and I appreciate that. I probably still have a way to go regarding this problem, but I trust in God's direction and in the sufficiency of his cross.
ReplyDeleteI thank the Lord for your life and for people like you, and I also thank him for providing vocations like the one you have. keep up the good work, God bless you.
Thank you, Dylan. Just remember that nobody can control the thoughts that come into their minds, and that random thoughts are harmless. They are not sins and they have no power. Trying not to think them guarantees that you will have them constantly (try for thirty seconds to think of anything in the world except alpacas, and you'll see what I mean).
DeleteJust ignore them. God does.
I’ve been having blasphemous Thoughts ! I didn’t even know what that was until I stumbled upon a YouTube video 3 months ago about unpardonable sin.
ReplyDeleteI started going to church a few weeks ago & opening up the Bible. I recently signed up for Bible studies. I’m also looking into seeing a therapist soon. I’ve always suffered from anxiety but now it’s gone up the roof upon this discovery.
I don’t know what God thinks of me and that is what scares me. I don’t deny Jesus who paid the price for all of our sins on the cross but I still have fear.
Read John 3:16 and substitute your name for "whoever." That is what God thinks of you.
DeleteI am being mercilessly berated by these evil thoughts. Everything i love pulls me back to the thoughts. I can't escape. I fel like a part of me wants to but i resis and now i don't know if I'm worth saving anymore. I can't say holy spirit is goos without a WAVE of blasphemy coming for me. Is it too late for me? I reject these thoughts but it's just an unwinnable battle with no resolve in sight. I feel like I'm just on this planet to suffer
ReplyDeleteTell you what. For the next minute or so, think of anything in the world except warthogs. OK. Ready? Go!
DeleteHow did you do? I already know: you were constantly besieged by thoughts of warthogs. That's because God created our minds to retain thoughts, not to exclude them. The very effort not to think a thought MAKES you think it!
Similary, if you are afraid of a thought, the fear will keep it just on the verge of your awareness, ready to pop out at an moment. The only answer is to recognize that random thoughts are just random thoughts. You have no control over them. God knows that. He also knows that the reason they keep coming into your mind is precisely that you are so afraid of them and are constantly trying to stop them.
The solution is to understand that God knows all of this and that the thoughts are not an issue for Him. They have no power and they have no significance. As strange as it may seem, the answer is to let them come and not react to them. They mean nothing. Just let them be there.
Cultivate the habit of letting the thoughts come if they want to and realize that they are just radio static. They mean nothing, and the only way they have any power or significance is if you give it to them. The more you can ignore them, the less frequently they will come. The less you react to them, the more they will fade. The secret is to remember that they're not even sins. Think of them as propaganda from the Enemy. The more you can simply let them come into your mind and not let yourself be bothered by them, the rarer and weaker they will become.
I would also advise you to see a therapist. It certainly sounds like you might have Obsessive Compulsive Disorder. There are medicines and techniques that can help. Some of the greatest Christians in history- Martin Luther, St. Therese, John Bunyan, St. Ignatius Loyola, and many others- have suffered from OCD and exactly the problem you describe. You are in good company, and you have many more tools for addressing the problem than they had!
What is speaking against the holy spirit mean? Is it just speaking against the truth of your sin? Because I'm scared of what this means and that I've lost eternally
ReplyDeleteIt means persisting in opposition to the Holy Spirit's witness to Jesus out of malice and against one's better knowledge to the point where one becomes so hardened against it that the Spirit no longer tries to convince that person. Nobody who is concerned about having done it has, since that very fact means that the Spirit's testimony is still getting through. In Greek it is in the present tense rather than in the aorist tense, meaning that it's an ongoing action rather than something that can be done at a specific moment.
ReplyDeleteI am being constantly tortured by relentless thought after thought. My mind is trying to convince me of blashpemous opinions and terrible things. I fear I'm too far gone, the darkness is growing and i feel alone. I can't even pray without it turning into ww3 in my head. I'm washed up and done for. I'm condemned
ReplyDeleteNobody who trusts in Jesus can ever be condemned.
ReplyDeleteRead what I've written above. The human mind is designed to retain information, not to exclude it. Try for thirty seconds to think of anything in the world except warthogs. You will think of nothing but warthogs!
Your trouble is that you are trying not to think those thoughts- which MAKES you think them!
They mean nothing. If they actually came from your heart, they wouldn't bother you.
Let the thoughts be there-and ignore them. They mean nothing. They are not sins. They are nothing but the inevitable consequence of trying not to think them. The very fact that you are bothered by them proves that you have nothing to fear from them!
My mi d is trying to convince me the pharisees were right and that terrifies me to no end. I know they are fake but my mind keeps trying to damn me but i refuse to give in. I'm considering suicide so i won't go that far if i haven't already. The devil will never have his fucking way with me. Not on my fucking watch
DeleteThen the devil WOULD win.
DeleteThe problem isn't your mind. It's working the way it's supposed to work: focusing on what it thinks is a crisis. BUT THE CRISIS IS IMAGINARY.
Look. All it is is a random thought.
Try to think of nothing but white elephants for the next minute. See what I mean? You can't think of anything but white elephants! If you're afraid of a thought, YOU WILL HAVE IT CONSTANTLY AND WILL BE UNABLE TO GET RID OF IT. The only way to deal with it is to recognize that it's harmless and to stop trying to keep it out of your mind!
If the thought was coming from you, it wouldn't bother you. It poses no danger. Don't try to get rid of it. Just let it be there and ignore it. Jesus says very clearly that He will never turn away anyone who comes to Him. If He was telling the truth when He said that, the Unpardonable Sin cannot be committed by anyone who wants to come to Him!
You need professional help. See a therapist. Call one TODAY. Not only will it help you to deal with your intrusive thoughts and what certainly sounds like OCD and even help you get medicine that can help, but suicidal thoughts are nothing to mess around with. This page will help: https://iocdf.org/ocdandfaith/
And remember: YOU ARE IN NO DANGER OF COMMITTING THE UNPARDONABLE SIN. You cannot be if the thought that you might bothers you!
While i was drowsy from bed or in a dream, my mind made terrible points on why god is bad, and the SCARIEST part was i believed them for a second, until i realized what I've done and repented. I feel so bad and fear i have gone too far
DeleteSounds like pure OCD. Even ordinary blasphemy must be spoken out loud. The thoughts that come into your head even when you are fully conscious are things you cannot control. But if you are afraid of a thought (despite the fact that thoughts are just thoughts), your mind will be drawn to it like metal to a magnet.
DeleteYou had nothing to repent of. And if you want God's friendship you have not gone too far. Neither have you committed the unforgivable sin if the thought that you might have done so bothers you.
Read the article and the rest of the comments.
My mind is trying to attribute gods work and the spirit to what isn't god. I am terrified of this. I am on medication and it's only getting worse. I am so fucking scared. I don't understand anything anymore, my reality is falling apart
DeleteThat's because you're afraid of doing that. Again, God made the human mind to retain information, not to exclude it; the example of trying to not think of white elephants illustrates this point. To be on guard against certain thoughts- like attributing God's work to someone or something other than God- is to automatically think them constantly. Your mistake is trying not to think them. Let them be there. Ignore them.
DeleteOCD always attacks what we are most afraid of. The very thought that you are afraid of that particular thing proves that you are in no danger of it. You might even go ahead and think the thoughts. Defy them! Since they don't come from your heart (you wouldn't be bothered by them if they did), and since God knows that, they are harmless. Your goal has to be to NOT be afraid of them. So let them come and let them be there. They are powerless unless you give them power by being afraid of them.
There are no limits to the mercy of god. But if anyone refuses to come to the knowledge of the truth by repenting, rejects the merciful offer of the holy spirit. Such hardness of heart can lead to final impenetance and eternal loss.
ReplyDeleteThe key word is "refuse." Neither faith nor repentence are achievements or acccomplishments or "decisions" of our own. Both are gifts of the Holy Spirit that can be refused by our own choice, but never initiated or obtained by anything we do. Otherwise salvation would be by works.
DeleteThere are no limits to the mercy of god. But if anyone refuses to come to the knowledge of the truth by repenting, rejects the merciful offer of the holy spirit. Such hardness of heart can lead to final impenetance and eternal loss.
ReplyDeleteBy yourself, you can't do anything BUT refuse. If you don't, that's by the grace of God. Yes, we can always say "no" to God. But only by God's grace can we say "yes."
DeleteReally This goes far beyond the commenting! It wrote his thoughts while reading the article amazingly. erp therapy
ReplyDeleteI’m terrified because I keep getting blasphemous thoughts about Jesus and what the Pharisees said and I DO. NOT. WANT. THEM. But I’m so scared because of mark 7:21-23… what if that means this sin can be committed in your mind? What if I committed this while seeking Jesus the most…? I want to scream, cry and just bang my head against the wall until I pass out.
ReplyDeleteDid you read the article and the rest of the comments?
Delete"What if" is the hallmark of OCD. What if you wake up in the morning with three noses? What if you fall of the face of the earth? You didn't. Period. And by definition blasphemy must be spoken out loud.
Secondly, you have the thoughts because you try not to have them. I've used this example many times in this thread, but try not to think of warthogs for sixty seconds. The act of trying to not think a thought makes you think it. You're afraid of a harmless and involuntary thought. It's your fear of the thought that makes you think it, and that's the reason why you keep thinking it.
And finally, if you had committed the sin Mark describes, again, by definition, you wouldn't care. Jesus promises over and over and over that nobody who comes to him will ever be rejected.
It comes down to whether or not Jesus is a liar.
I was tormented by intrusive blasphemous thoughts one morning. I fell back asleep and when I woke up I heard something blasphemous against the Holy Spirit. I'm afraid that I may have said it in my sleep since I've been known to talk in my sleep. Will I be forgiven?
ReplyDeleteFor what? First, you didn't do anything. Secondly, you certainly didn't do anything o'n purpose. Third, if you had committed the Unpardonable Sin, you wouldn't care.
DeleteC'mon. This is pure OCD. If you've read the article you know with the rational part of your mind what the answer is.You're seeking reassurance in the form of a question which the rational and healthy part of your mind knows already knows the answer to. The One Who went to the cross to take your sins onto Himself and suffer what you deserved to suffer is not going to send you to hell on a technicality!
I fear I committed this sin by telling a pastor what my thoughts were
ReplyDeleteHave you read the article? If you have, you will understand that that very fact proves that you haven't committed it.
DeleteI never quiet understood the logic of “if you are concerned then you have not committed it.” Is it possible to talk more in a more private setting where I could go into some more detail? My email is rpmcbride01@gmail.com
DeleteDoesn’t the fact that prayer doesn’t have to be out loud mean that things can be spoken in thoughts? I don’t have OCD as far as I know but it’s been confirmed through various people who don’t know each other that I have been in the fros of spiritual warfare for the last few weeks. Thoughts come into my silent prayers and basically ruin them. Today because I was afraid of the thoughts coming back I went there on purpose I think with the idea that if one can control the scary thing it loses its scariness. I was immediately hit with conviction that it was the worst way possible to handle the fear and I have been begging for forgiveness all day but I really feel like I have lost my salvation even though I didn’t truly believe the thought and I didn’t think it with the intention of being disrespectful. I keep completely zoning out when I try to pray now and I feel completely numb and empty…I don’t know
ReplyDeleteNo; spoken means spoken, not thought. And intrusive thoughts happen to everybody- especially to those who are afraid of them and are trying not to think them. Try not thinking about polar bears for sixty seconds! The very fear of thought makes it come.
DeleteThe spiritual warfare here is the Enemy trying to get you to fear the simple operation of the basic laws of psychology in order to get you to doubt your salvation. THAT is his goal.
What you feel is irrelevant. Emotions are not an indicator of spiritual (or any other kind) of truth. The issue here isn't what you feel, but what is real. And what is real is Christ's promise that "whoever comes to Me I will never cast out." The devil is trying to get you to doubt John 6 37-39 in order to prevent you from trusting Jesus and to get you to believe the lie that Romans 8 to the contrary, a mere random thought CAN seperate you from the love of God in Jesus.
Emotions lie. Jesus doesn'. Don't believe the lie. And remember: nobody who wants forgiveness and salvation are EVER denied it. And if you aren't sure you intended the thought (whatever that means), you didn't. Again, the Father of Lies is trying to work doubt where the Holy Spirit wants to work faith and trust in the promises of Jesus that would have to be lies for your feelings to be true.
I fear that I may have committed this sin in my mind when I was a Jehovah Witnesses. I also hear voices that blaspheme the Holy Spirit and my mind tries to grab hold of what the voices are saying and I have to say "go away satan" I'm terrified that I could be condemned. I also don't have the holy spirit. Also didn't Jesus say that adultery can be commited in the heart, so why can't this sin be commited in the heart or mind?
ReplyDeleteWhatever else you may do in your mind, you can't blaspheme in your mind. To blaspheme you must speak the words out loud. If you believe in Jesus as your Savior you have the Holy Spirit. And the blasphemy against the Holy Spirit isn't a thing you say at a moment in time. It's finally and decisively rejecting the witness of the Holy Spirit to Jesus, which you cannot have done if you are concerned about having done so.
DeleteAlso you not only don't have to say "go away, Satan," but probably shouldn't. To try to not think a thought is to think it. If you doubt that try for the next sixty seconds not to think about white elephants! What you have to do is recognize that you have no control over the thoughts that cross your mind and that they don't matter. Ignore them. Try to stop them and they'll stick with you like glue.
DeleteHi Robert. Is the fear that one accidentally said the unpardonable sin out loud, without fully knowing if they actually did or not, a common OCD theme?
ReplyDeleteYes. And of course, you can't.
DeleteHi Robert. Is it common with OCD to fear one might have accidentally said the unpardonable sin out loud? And also to not be sure if they did or not?
ReplyDeleteSee above.
Delete